Why you should come to Balticon

For any and all info or discussion of podcasts and podcasting. Also community related miscellanea.
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jannypie
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by jannypie » Tue Jun 01, 2010 7:32 pm

dreamrock wrote:
jannypie wrote:I saw Dreamrock, I don't know if we were ever officially introduced?
:lol: Nope. Our closest proximity was at the bar and you were preoccupied being an awesome human being, as Norm noted. Awesome human beings get brownies, but I didn't have any with me. :(

I'm not so hot at introducing myself anyway. :oops: Not counting StalinSays and Norm, I spoke to Bell, Tee Morris, Nutchtas, and James Durham ... almost entirely the doing of the other people in the conversation. Haha.
Bummer, yeah, I get preoccupied easily when I'm drinking all day. I meant to come back to your table and hang for a bit, but after the bathroom girl I think I was diverted into talking with Rossi.

Later on I went back to check on bathroom girl, and there was a group of people there helping her. Only one of them knew her, and she was very rude to me about wanting to make sure she got back to their room. Kind of a, gee, you're welcome for watching over your drunk friend for an hour while you weren't around, kinda moment. : p

I got to meet your group, Mur Lafferty, John Cmar, Phil Rossi and Matt Wallace obviously, Christiana Ellis, a few peeps from the Sigler forums, Chooch (? plays in Rossi's band), and ran into but didn't have the whole formal introduction thing with Tee, Phillippa, Axelrod, probably a bunch of others.
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jannypie
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by jannypie » Tue Jun 01, 2010 7:44 pm

I failed on the photos end of things, didn't take nearly enough and I didn't get any of the Drabblefolk at all. Boo, me.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/15361807@N ... alticon44/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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dreamrock
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by dreamrock » Tue Jun 01, 2010 7:51 pm

jannypie wrote:Art and stuff with technical reproducibility- This was one I really wanted to go to and it was... interesting. From my viewpoint copyright is a big topic right now among all the handmade artists and small businesses such as on Etsy, so I was hoping to get some ideas on how copyright protection might be changing. Mostly the panel and people there were coming at it from a producer/podcast viewpoint, or as something they view as a hobby rather than a business, which are things they want spread around for the recognition, so their comments held a laissez-faire feel to them. I think the mentality of "there's nothing you can do about it, so you might as well share-and-steal-alike" is a source of the copyright issue from the start, so it becomes this circular argument. This is something I really could go on and on about, but I will restrain myself. :)
J. Daniel Sawyer is taking a practical approach to copyright in podcasts and what podcast authors need to be aware of. That was one of the panels I slept through so I don't remember if he was there or not, but he's taking the subject pretty seriously. He's got an interview with Dead Robots Society that came out last Thursday and an interview on Fullcast Podcast that go into some detail on it. He's starting up a new media copyright information thinger which should be up sometime in June.

Unfortunately, even that is going to be focused on audio copyright which is bound to be a little different than copyright in physical media. There is a decent amount of information that is in a not-too-hard-to-digest form on Copyright.gov. If you're concerned about running afoul of other people's copyright and trademark, I'd poke Joel Watson from HijiNKS Ensue to see if he'd be willing to talk about his experiences. He ran into a potentially bad situation when he created his Edward shirt because Edward James Olmos hadn't approved it beforehand. When his people found out about it, they were really cool because that's how they roll, but the situation could have been a disaster.

As far as other people infringing on your copyright goes, I think the best thing would be to get a boiler plate Cease and Desist letter together and learn how to contact a website's ISP (I don't know how to do this, or I'd point you in the right direction) in case the offenders aren't taking you seriously. Unless someone huge infringes on your copyright, a C&D that gets the offenders to take the work down is going to be more cost effective for you than hiring a lawyer everytime someone steals your work.
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jannypie
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by jannypie » Tue Jun 01, 2010 8:32 pm

YOU should have been on the panel! Thanks for the info.
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dreamrock
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by dreamrock » Tue Jun 01, 2010 8:49 pm

jannypie wrote:YOU should have been on the panel! Thanks for the info.
:lol: No worries.
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by tbaker2500 » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:38 am

Sounds like an exhausting time. Ignatius, how could you not meet with with Jannypie? Unless you're married, I mean.
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by dreamrock » Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:53 am

tbaker2500 wrote:Sounds like an exhausting time. Ignatius, how could you not meet with with Jannypie? Unless you're married, I mean.
I'm not married, but I am a wuss. :lol:
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by tbaker2500 » Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:17 am

Oh. Well, been there, done that.
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normsherman
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by normsherman » Wed Jun 02, 2010 2:36 am

dreamrock wrote:
jannypie wrote:Art and stuff with technical reproducibility- This was one I really wanted to go to and it was... interesting. From my viewpoint copyright is a big topic right now among all the handmade artists and small businesses such as on Etsy, so I was hoping to get some ideas on how copyright protection might be changing. Mostly the panel and people there were coming at it from a producer/podcast viewpoint, or as something they view as a hobby rather than a business, which are things they want spread around for the recognition, so their comments held a laissez-faire feel to them. I think the mentality of "there's nothing you can do about it, so you might as well share-and-steal-alike" is a source of the copyright issue from the start, so it becomes this circular argument. This is something I really could go on and on about, but I will restrain myself. :)
As far as other people infringing on your copyright goes, I think the best thing would be to get a boiler plate Cease and Desist letter together and learn how to contact a website's ISP (I don't know how to do this, or I'd point you in the right direction) in case the offenders aren't taking you seriously. Unless someone huge infringes on your copyright, a C&D that gets the offenders to take the work down is going to be more cost effective for you than hiring a lawyer everytime someone steals your work.
yah, unfortunately the discussion did lean toward the Creative Commons side of things, which is where most New Media geeks tend to dwell. I failed at trying to get discussion going regarding the regulatory "other" side, and at defending Phil for being against derivative work that is made from his. 50 minutes just isn't enough time to even scratch the surface of a topic that complex, with so many viewpoints and interests on both sides.

Dreamrock nails it though. Cease and Desist letter if you want to sound formal and scary, but an email informing the offender that that the image is yours, is copyrighted and is being used without your permission, along with an ask to take it down (if that's what you want) should do the trick. If it doesn't-- yah, send a Cease and Desist to the ISP, they won't mess around. I do this every 8 or 9 months with my stuff from the first CD that shows up on BeeMp3 now and then.

The system is far from perfect, but the law is definitely aligned with the interest of copyright holders in the U.S.-- anyone you confront with a legitimate case will almost certainly back down if they know what's good for them.
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dreamrock
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by dreamrock » Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:00 pm

Two sample C&Ds:

http://www.webmastertechniques.com/Insight/cease.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.utsystem.edu/ogc/INTELLECTUA ... /cease.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are problems with both. One, I'd take out the lawsuit threat unless you're prepared to lawyer up (in which case, have the lawyer write the C&D). Two, one of them says you've registered the copyright. It's not necessary to pre-register copyright in order to have a valid case. If you're making lots of money, it would make sense to register because of the advantages (like higher potential payout, including payment of your legal fees if you win), but otherwise it's probably going to be hard to turn a profit if you're paying the registration fee on every new work you produce. So, I'd take that part out too.

Like Norm said, for normal run of the mill offenders, you probably want to start with a nice letter instead of a C&D. In fact, if they're just borrowing the image to use as a picture on a blog or something, it may be better to ask them to link to you rather than take it down since that can get you more exposure. If you're dealing with someone selling shirts or other products with your images on it, I'd definitely stop them.
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by normsherman » Wed Jun 02, 2010 8:06 pm

The guy next to me on the panel (forgot his name-- bad mod, bad!) made an interesting point. If you find someone actually making money from your content online, you basically just got handed over a lot of expensive strategic marketing work and research on a silver platter. They've done all the legwork in uncovering and exploiting the market, found a channel to supply a demand with what only you can produce. Not only can you shut the infringer down, you can pick up on that new consumer demand where he/she left off.
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jannypie
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by jannypie » Thu Jun 03, 2010 4:25 am

I haven't personally had an issue yet, it's more of a general awareness and desire to be informed. Although there was a humorous bit on my blog about my using the words Ohio Rocks together. That guy gave me the most poorly formed C&D letter I've ever seen, obviously copied from somewhere and not at all applicable to the situation.

Anyways, I did understand the point about eventually profiting if someone else uses your work, but in my market it doesn't really work that way, because the identity of the source can be lost so easily and quickly that it is more likely it will never be linked back to you. The people who buy handmade are a huge market, but have only limited buying sources (such as Etsy.com, or artfire.com). It's direct competition for the same buyers, and it goes so quickly it's nearly impossible to keep up. Anything posted can be copied, altered just a bit, and set for sale almost immediately. Nearly the entire community is also networked via Twitter and blogs, as well, and you want your ideas to be seen but that just means your pictures are grabbed and posted willy-nilly. There's also a colossal gray area when it comes to art and crafts, about what is "inspired" versus "copied", how much of an original something you can use, what parts can be altered to make improvements and therefore be legitimate changes... I know there isn't any cut and dried answer, it's just an interesting topic to me.

The best solution I've come across isn't Creative Commons but actually watermarks. It's a PITA to add them to every photo, and they can take away visually from what you're trying to show, but online there doesn't seem to be any other way to keep your name linked with your idea.
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jannypie
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by jannypie » Thu Jun 03, 2010 4:33 am

Image
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by dreamrock » Fri Jun 04, 2010 3:15 am

jannypie wrote:Image
:lol: Yes, St. Tom, Janny, and I are spamming up twitter with Norm-song quotage.
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by normsherman » Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:04 am

Haha that's awesome. love you guys
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Re: Why you should come to Balticon

Post by jannypie » Sun Jun 06, 2010 4:20 pm

I'm just glad I finally have someone to sing with, all my friends just think I have Tourette's. Especially when I bust out a high singsongy 'Drabble' every now and then.
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